More Views From HillaryLand

Tell me you're not going to let them get away with this Michael. They were claiming she would win Indiana by 6-7 points. The polls that had Obama winning in Indiana lasted little more than a week. No Democratic President (including Bill Clinton) has won more than 40% of the white vote since Harry Truman.

Every sensible poll shows the gas tax might very well have been WHAT lost them all this support.

Are you EVER going to call them on ANYTHING Michael? Or at least question it WHEN you're talking to them?

stinger: I think Michael's job is just to report what questions were asked and what the answers were. Unless of course its McCain then he will write out explainations and defenses.

"Asked if the campaign has had any discussions about not going forward with the campaign, Wolfson said, "No. No discussions.""

He was being sarcastic, right?

This is somebody who has spent her whole life in the village.

Wasn't she a Goldwater gal as a youngster? Small matter, but still.

"Shocked the world?"

....right. The benefit of low standards....

I'm waiting patiently for the day when the people who are currently telling me how hateful and hypocritical an Obamabot I am, turn around and politely start asking me for money to target ads in Indiana and Tennessee.

"Wolfson admitted a brief IM exchange with Obama strategist David Axelrod yesterday. "We exchanged pleasantries." Wouldn't it be interesting to know what those look like."

Wolfdog67: :-\

TheRod22: :-)

Wolfdog67: :-(

TheRod22: :-D! :-D!

Wolfdog67: >:-(

TheRod22: ;-)

Wolfdog67: :-P

TheRod22: :-*

Wolfdog67: What the f---?

I don't think it should shock anyone that Hillary's camp is still trying to spin. The only problem is Hillary has no more goal posts to move. This thing is done. She can stay as long as she wants, but its done.

Somebody please, PLEASE, fortheluvvagod ask Wolfson (or McAuliffe, or HERSELF) this question:

If Clinton is so appalled at the possibility of MI and FL not being seated, what the hell was she doing (as the then-prohibitive frontrunner) when her party was making the initial decision? Is she a hypocrite, or just wholly incompetent?

I've been looking for an answer to that one for months, and nobody will even take a swing at it.

So I'm feel sympathetic to Hillary this morning because it's all over, but on the other hand...

She's become just like one of those abusive people in relationships, whether parents, lovers, friends, or bosses, who set conditions for what you have to do in order to get what you want, and then when you've done it - oops, now you have to do this. As in any abusive relationship, there is no end to this. So the supers and voters in upcoming states have to be the adults in this campaign and stop her.

That's hilarious D_L.

Just wondering, is there anyone from the Swampland crew covering St. McCain's campaign?

"Just wondering, is there anyone from the Swampland crew covering St. McCain's campaign?"

Why McCain Fluffer? Did he make another inane statement that needs defending?

A quarter of Republicans are still voting against him in primaries.

Here's some McCain coverage:

McCain embraces Bush's radical views of executive power

John McCain yesterday delivered a speech in which he hailed the inspiring constitutional principles of Government on which our country was founded, including the central goal of avoiding excessive, unlimited power in any one branch, secured by checks and balances from the other two branches:

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/?source=rss

"We shocked the world!"

The Macker never ceases to amaze me. It never rains in Terry-Land!

Here's some more McCain coverage:

McCain's FEC Problem

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/05/todays_must_read_332.php

KT is there any Time/Swampland employee covering Senator McCain? Not snark. it just seems looking back over the last week or so that no one is.
Posted by Paul-no not that one | May 5, 2008 7:25 PM

I guess no answer is an answer.

McCain embraces Bush's radical views of executive power

Maybe KT can take it up. She's the only one who seems to have noticed that there might be an issue with the executive branch's power grabs.

Dammit, McCain Fluffer beat me to it.

Why is there ZERO McCain coverage on this page?

As I said yesterday:

I think it is incredibly naive to think that the Clintons are ever going to stop campaigning.

If Obama had won every state but NY by 20 points, the Clintons would argue that only the NY voters count.

Their craven lust for power knows no bounds. Think about what they've done over the past few months:

- Thrown away their most loyal voting bloc: African-Americans
- Advanced the idea that Obama can't win because he is black. At the very least advocated that Obama can't win because white people won't vote for him.
- Promised to "obliterate" Iran, and its population of 65 million people. Let's be clear. Obliterating Iran would mean killing at least 30 million people with the push of a few buttons.
- Lied repeatedly about the gas tax in order to offer false hope to people who are desperate.
- Alienated every voter in the caucus states by saying, "they don't matter." How they square up the rhetoric about caucus states not counting while saying Michigan and Florida should count is a mystery.
- And let's never forget the Hillary voted for the Iraq war because she thought it was the right thing to do politically. That alone means she sent 4,000 US servicemen and women to their deaths so that she would have a shot at the White House.

To think that people capable of the above will stop campaigning is, charitably, unrealistic.

Should Obama win the nomination the Clintons will actively but quietly, work to undermine him.

Should Obama win the White House you can rest assured that Hillary will use every tool at her disposal to prevent him from getting anything through the Senate.

Let's take her at her word, she's a fighter. She believes she is entitled to the White House, and she'll destroy everything in her path. She doesn't care about us. She cares about herself.

"It's 3am and the phone is ringing...

Do you know where your $11.4 million dollars is?"

OVERCONFIDENCE CARRIES A HEFTY PRICETAG.

Still, there's always Secretary of State or Governor of New York.

WTF? The gas tax holiday helped you? You must think that we are stupid....I want to see them play basketball and Obama can give her a facial ala Danny green style. Hell NC would have loved it.

By the way, Dis_Lib, it looks like AMC ripped off your skit in the post above Scherer's.

Just wondering, is there anyone from the Swampland crew covering St. McCain's campaign?

I'm afraid this question does not compute. Here are a couple of variations you could try:

"Just wondering, has anyone from the Swampland crew ever covered St. McCain's campaign?"

or

"Just wondering, is there anyone from the Swampland crew still working on St. McCain's media surrogate/sockpuppet team?"

My friends, I was wondering about the lack of McCain Coverage in light of some developments. As mentioned above, his apparent embrace of the Bush's executive power grab, I am also interested in hearing about Bush trying to stack the deck at the FEC to help get rid of McCain's campaign finance problem:
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/05/todays_must_read_332.php

There's spin, and there's delusional spin.

http://gprr.blogspot.com/2008/05/path-ahead-according-to-plouffe-and.html

Shocked the world, eh?

That's some grade-A crazy right there.

KathyR - Wow! What a connection. I never thought of it that way but you're absolutely right. I'm surprised I didn't think of it myself. It is so totally the modus operandi of an abuser...

It is over. HRC knows it too. The only reason she´s still in it is that there is a slim, slim chance of Obama making some sort of a huge blunder or whatever.

I'll support HRC as far as she wants to take this, which I doubt will be much further.

When she concedes, I absolutely expect her to fully back Obama and do any kind of campaigning for him that he asks her to do.

If Hillary had been running a positive campaign, I'd fully support her continuing. She'd probably also would have won the nomination by now. Her negativity is what's causing the party to crumble - not the fact that there's a close race.

When did it become OK for lying to be chalked up to "spin?" I know I'm about 4 years too late with the question, but it still bothers me.

Crush:
Did you see the quote yesterday by T-Mac(No, not Tracy MacGrady), where he said Hillary could drink John McBush under the table?

Well, all this is a joke.

After all what's have been said, done and spent, after all that bitter campain, Hillary's supporters are going to be so pissed that they won't move a finger when it's time to vote for the real thing, you know, the real presidential election.
Ahahaha, even if half the republican's votes go for McCain, that'll still be more than the few democrate's voters that won't go fishing that day.

All that money and time wasted. Believe me, primaries are crap. Go to the french system :
2 rounds, 2 weeks.
First round, any candidate can run, provided it has 500 signatures from city mayors. Second round, the two candidates with the best scores are allowed to run. Directly electly by the voters, no delegates. Cheap, fast, efficient.

Here's more McCain coverage you apparently can't get at Swampland because they are sooooo busy:

"McCain on equal pay: ‘I don’t think you’re doing anything to help the rights of women.’"

Last month, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) skipped the vote on the Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, which would have made it easier for women and other workers to pursue pay discrimination claims. At the time, McCain explained his opposition to the bill by saying that instead of equal pay protection, women simply needed “education and training.“ Asked about his opposition to the bill at a townhall today, McCain told a 14-year old girl that he didn’t think protections for equal pay would do “anything to help the rights of women“:

http://thinkprogress.org/

Thanks to KT and Commenters for birthday greeting. Appreciated.

It is time for HRC to bow out, gracefully. She is not going to be unemployed. No: the pushing and shoving has to stop. Time for a class act. Support Obama. Help move those wc votes in his direction. Tell Paul Begala his kind of comment is unhelpful. If she has the welfare of Democrats and the Democratic Party in her heart and mind then now is the time to show it.

My guess is that Obama will respond with a class act, too. Now it is time to go get the Saint.

Here's a question: Is Scherer playing some sort of weird, subtle mind game in order to get commentors to actually go out and do his reporting for him?

I may be giving him too much credit, but I see far more useful information in the comments here than what he ever presents.

What I learned from reading this post:

This campaign is running on Bill's money.
The gas tax thing either didn't work at all, or worked against them.
There have been discussions of a joint ticket.
Hillary's campaign would have trouble raising money in the GE.
There were discussions of ending the campaign but Hillary would have none of it.
Hillary thinks the village needs to be destroyed in order to be saved.

"I may be giving him too much credit, but I see far more useful information in the comments here than what he ever presents."

True...and there's more investigative journalism in the comments section at TPM than there is the average dead tree edition of Time.

"Did you see the quote yesterday by T-Mac(No, not Tracy MacGrady), where he said Hillary could drink John McBush under the table?"
I posted the link here...can't you just picture Maverick and Hillary with arms around each other's necks, swaying back and forth, each w/ a bottle in hand, singing 'How Dry I Am'.

It's really just an ego thing, a stubborn refusal to believe that she is not going to be the nominee. In the beginning she convinced herself that she was destined to be President, and now she just cannot believe that it is not going to happen. A case of denial.

No Hillary voters will go to vote for Obama in GE, they're pissed now. And the opposite is true, in any cases, McCain won.

Hillary is as arrogant as she is stupid.... YOU LOST... GO AWAY!!!!

Happy Birthday, bitterpill8.

"Hillary is as arrogant as she is stupid.... YOU LOST... GO AWAY!!!!"

Sure, it's the right thing to say to insure that Hillary's voters won't go fishing on GE's day.
McCain wins and wins again.

From reading the commentary here, now I feel like giving money to Hillary's campaign (as I never have done so before):

Dear Stuart,

Today, in every way that I know how, I am expressing my personal determination to keep forging forward in this campaign.

After our come-from-behind victory in Indiana, there are just 28 days of voting left. But we've never campaigned with the stakes as high or the time as short as they will be over the next four weeks.

And with you by my side, I'm going to keep fighting for what I believe in until every voter has had his or her say.

From the very beginning, you and I have counted on one another, working through every challenge and seizing every opportunity. That's not just the way our campaign works. That's the way America works.

As we enter the final four weeks of this contest, let's keep working our hearts out.

Contribute now to keep moving our campaign forward.

In six days, we have the chance to show our strength in West Virginia. If you'll stand with me, it's an opportunity I intend to make the most of.

There's no question about it -- we've got to make every one of these next 28 days count -- starting with today.

Contribute now, and let's keep winning together.

As we've told each other time and time again. There will be good days and not so good days in the course of this campaign. But there will never be a day that we can't count on one another.

As we enter the final 28 days of voting, I know you'll give it everything you've got. And you know I will do the same.

Thanks for being such a wonderful friend and ally,

Hillary Rodham Clinton

You really have to admire that kind of dedication to a cause, whether you believe in it or not. I wish that John Kerry had it in 2004 when we were all waiting for 300,000 ballots in Ohio to be counted.

I love seeing commentary that sounds exactly like Republicans online in 2000, e.g. "Get Over It!" (and by "love" I mean that I am thoroughly disappointed and disgusted at those lovely displays of Democratic "unity").

I admit that I am a Barack Obama supporter. I would not be registered to vote if it were not for Barack Obama. However, I would rather have Hillary Clinton than John McCain for President. Having said that, I have not been anti Hillary Clinton until now. With the results from North Carolina and Indiana in, it is now time for her to get out of the race. She has now taken on the appearance of a desperate, sore loser. She is trying anything and everything to gain the nomination, from trying to seat Florida and Michigan (when their vote was clearly against party rules) to trying to sway individual Obama pledged delegates. We do not need a President who will do anything and everything to get what they want and it does not speak well of her ethics. It is time to for her to get out and move on to defeating John McCain – in which case there may yet be a political future for her.

Hillary's lust for power is appalling.... One wonders if this "If I can't win, no Dem will" attitude is a plot at this point to ensure McCain's win and the continuance of the Bush/Clinton Coalition. It's almost as if she would rather have McCain in the White House than Obama?

The woman is totally NOT trustworthy.

And just how does she "lend" herself money? How is it paid back?

We still have 28 more days of this crap? *Slams head repeatedly against wall*

And for the record, I think that's why we're getting comments like redseagrass's - people are getting grouchy at how long this is getting dragged out.

Relax already, she's getting out...she just needs the space to not appear as if she's being forced out. I expect that the negative stuff will be toned down, but if not and she continues to go neg w/ this ridiculous elitist crap, then by all means fire away, but that's not gonna happens, so chill.

Short of doing something underhanded, she cannot win.... WHY is she hanging there like stink on a monkey?

Apparently she still feels ENTITLED to the presidency even though the people have clearly spoken the name OBAMA.

And her "gas tax holiday" is moronic (worthy of Bush) and should be enough in and of itself to scare off anyone from voting for her.

At this point Hillary is the new Ralph Nader: SPOILER.

The more I think about it, the more certain I feel that she's going to get out, and soon. Here's why:

http://gprr.blogspot.com/2008/05/shes-in-until-shes-out.html

Just compare the possible exits...with a whimper or with overwhelming class and style. I think she will opt for the latter.

Cincinnatus: ..she just needs the space to not appear as if she's being forced out...

That, and she probably needs to raise some more funds to pay back the debt she's accrued.

People on the probable victor's side are getting understandably grouchy at their candidate not winning faster.

After all, it's her fault! They want their victory parade, right now!

Right.

(where's my checkbook, again?)

Stuart,

There's some speculation (I first heard Russert say it, so consider the source) that part of the negotiations for Clinton to exit the campaign include Obama paying off her debts, so you might actually want to write that check to the Obama campaign.

oh.... and no offense meant to the monkey!

Hillary's fiscal management skills remind of a Blondie cartoon in a 60s cartoon where Blondie is unable to understand why there's no money when she has plenty of checks left in her checkbook!

I’ve been pretty patient with this primary so far, but now I think it’s time that Hillary finds a way to call it quits. I think the best thing for the party (and ultimately the nation) is to bow out, take a break, and then help Obama win the GE: I would expect him to do the same if their positions were reversed.

If she is serious about taking this all the way to the convention- and I’m afraid she is- she isn’t proving herself as a fighter, she’ll be a suicide bomber... and she might do something stupid enough to screw it up for us all. The media- and the public- NEEDS a break from this before the GE gets into full swing.

Stuart: Thanks.

"People on the probable victor's side are getting understandably grouchy at their candidate not winning faster.

After all, it's her fault! They want their victory parade, right now!

Right."

I wasn't trying to bag on Clinton - I hope Obama wins, but if Clinton gets it I'll vote for her. I'm tired of the whole primary process, and all the he-said she-said stuff, and all the accusations of racism and sexism and elitism, and all the reporting on it. What makes it worse is that I know we've got the GE coming up, which will be pretty much the same stuff. It's wearing me out.

I also feel like the primaries are taking up so much attention that people aren't paying attention to the other things going on - Iraq, Afghanistan, Burma, all the shady dealings at the EPA.

Cliff: I also feel like the primaries are taking up so much attention that people aren't paying attention to the other things going on..

Agreed.

I suggest redseagrass, Uncanny Valet, et al read this column for a little perspective.

http://mediamatters.org/columns/200804300001

Until this election cycle, journalists simply did not consider it to be their job to tell a contender when he or she should stop campaigning.

In this case, Howard Dean, the head of the Democratic National Committee, said he was "dumbfounded" by public demands for Clinton to drop out last month. (He now wants one of the candidates to quit after the final June 3 primary.) Yet lots of pundits have suggested that in a neck-and-neck campaign in which neither candidate will likely secure the nomination based on pledged delegates, Sen. Hillary Clinton must drop out before all the states have had a chance to vote.

I suggest that supporters have taken some of their information from the media obsession.

Focus on the state party building opportunities. At this point it will be a good thing to continue until June 3rd. If you heard every word from Michelle and Barack Obama's mouth through a prism that put them in the worst possible light (and soon you will), you might not think so highly of them.

After the last primary, I have no doubt that enough super delegates will make their preference known to give him the nomination. As you saw from McGovern today, they have no problem changing their minds.

Cliff... I agree also.... seems like there should be a national primary... over and DONE with.... and then a direct (dump the electoral college) election.. over a DONE with...

this seems like a nightmare version of some lame reality TV show that never ends...

Hillary needs to quit so we can concentrate on the fall election.... doesn't she have a day job?

While I agree with the sentiment that it's not the press' job to signal when someone should quit, I also appreciate the term "mathematical improbability."

I'm not a patient person but it isn't my impatience that wants her to drop out. Hillary is determined to do this the hard way and I'm worried a continually aggressive campaign might do some irreparable damage. What could possibly change voter's minds between now and then that isn't going to be a gaffe or something else equally stupid? Also, I just want a break.

...But if you think that a continued campaign is good for the party, then let's keep going! I disagree, but I wouldn't mind being proven wrong. Whatever helps Dems in the GE...

Fellow bloggers: HRC and WJC are classic snake oil salespersons. They love the stage & will only leave it kicking & screaming. While they are on stage, they are promoting their next book or speech. Why in the world would you think these 2 super-egotists would even dream of leaving when they have the stage? It's business, baby. Just like all their staff: they are looking for the fallout in terms of jobs and book royalties. Come on, folks. Get real. They are just causing mayhem to sell their next adventure. $109 Million? You ain't seen nothing yet. Finally, FL and MI. If the Dems try to seat these folks with the numbers currently in HRC's favor, I predict a full scale fist fight on May 31. My guess is SOMEONE will show some adult leadrship and stop this train wreck, or it's McCain for certain in 09. I'm just a student of macro-psychology and am amazed that there are so many deluded Dems that are actually voting for this woman. Amazing, simply amazing.

Also, like grape_crush mentioned, could we get some more coverage of the Bloch raid? Just what the heck is going on with that?

I was going to mention the Bloch raid -- NPR keeps saying that the investigation has widened. This definitely has political implications -- so, Swampers???

AMC, surely you could take a little rest from snarking on HRC and check into this -- Ms. Doan is quite snarkable, and then there's Ferragamo Condi. Although it's serious enough that it should really be a Karen story.

"this seems like a nightmare version of some lame reality TV show that never ends..."

You put it better than I did. Even though the long primary seems like it will have some benefits, it's still a pain. Sometimes (many times, really) the healthy activity and the unpleasant activity are one and the same.

Where do some of you come up with the thought of HRC being "entitled"? For arguably the most important job on the planet, would you really want to see someone give it less than their total effort?

I'm not saying HRC is right or wrong to keep going, but I like her spirit. As a coach of youth athletes, I've seen some that have walked all over their competition; eh, big deal... It's the ones who have no business being in the fight in the first place, and who you know are going to lose, but try like hell, anyway, that stand out the most, for me. Maybe they _are_ too dumb for their own good; I'm not going to tell 'em that.

So, HRC, as long as you want to keep slugging, you go, girl. Just try to keep it clean, 'k?

ivb: Good call the Block raid looks like its going to be really interesting. Something really strange is going on with this. I can't put my finger on it yet, but I'm not sure if we are looking at a geniune law enforcement effort here or an effort to cover up and bury evidence. Can't wait to how it shakes out.